> chat > Sat 2004-02-21

Chat for Sat 2004-02-21 14:57:51

rich-c: confirm
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to Daniel Bienvenu
Daniel Bienvenu: Hi Rich!
Daniel Bienvenu: I'm late?
rich-c: Salut, Daniel - ca va?
Daniel Bienvenu: oui, ca va! et toi?
rich-c: no, you're right on time, even early
rich-c: camarch
rich-c: ca marche
Daniel Bienvenu: good!
rich-c: getting some real Canadian weather now - blowing snow, temperature dropping
Daniel Bienvenu: yeah! but not too much snow here.
rich-c: starterd a bit over freezing this a.m. but has deteriorated since
rich-c: did you see what they got in Halifax? almost a meter in 24 hours!
Daniel Bienvenu: I think they got about 1m of snow
rich-c: there was a picture in teh paper of a guy on snowshoes on a main street
Daniel Bienvenu: 80cm yesturday (or wednesday?) + 20cm now...
rich-c: his shoulder was level with the parking sign on the lamppost he was passing
rich-c: he was looking down on the awning of a store on the other side
Daniel Bienvenu: here, we have 20cm in two days ... and the cars SLIDE on the road
rich-c: quebec does not allow studded tires, does it?
Daniel Bienvenu: It's the brown things they put on the road... what is the word...
rich-c: don't know - here they use salt sometimes mixed with sand
Daniel Bienvenu: here we use sand too... but most of the time, we use "calcium".
Daniel Bienvenu: I want to go at the university right now. I will be online again in about 25 minutes... if everything is ok.
rich-c: do they go for bare street plowing in Quebec or just leave it passable?
rich-c: OK, since I know you're coming, I'll wait
Daniel Bienvenu: the main streets are ok...
Daniel Bienvenu: and it's why I can go to the university right now
rich-c: snow tires should do the job unless the temperature is close to freezing
rich-c: anyway off you go then and will see you shortly
Daniel Bienvenu: Here, only those with a good job have tires for winters. my father is using 4 seasons tires during 4 years before change them
Daniel Bienvenu: it's "slipery?"
rich-c: yes, for my truck snow tires and wheels would cost about $800 - just not owrth it
Daniel Bienvenu: btw i have to go now.
Daniel Bienvenu: bye!
rich-c: "slippery" - glissant (?) - when snow packs down
rich-c: au 'voir
Daniel Bienvenu: hey! i'm happy! i finally use a new word you know. :) Yes, "glissant" is the word i wanted to use.
Daniel Bienvenu: aurevoir
Daniel Bienvenu left chat session
rich-c: refresh
rich-c: refresh
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to Daniel Bienvenu
Daniel Bienvenu: De retour
rich-c: welcome back!
Daniel Bienvenu: thank you!
rich-c: you made a quick trip
Daniel Bienvenu: no trafic outside
rich-c: if it's really slippery, that makes sense
rich-c: doubt too many Saturday shoppers are out this afternoon here, either
Daniel Bienvenu: Well, i don't see many cars outside... only a few
rich-c: in my neighbourhood, there is always very little Saturday traffic
rich-c: many of teh neighbours are Orthodox Jews and they are not allowed to drive on Sabbath
Daniel Bienvenu: James is doing a coleco web site to sell new coleco games and to "group" programmers togheter in a single community. I think we are re-doing a Coleco industry.
rich-c: wow, he is rally getting ambitiousays something about the age of the Internet that he can organize this effort from Japan
rich-c: if it gets going he could end up with a group from at leasst five continents
Daniel Bienvenu: The world is too small :)
rich-c: considering how many folks it hass to support, it's kind of crowded these days
rich-c: how many do you think the group will attract?
Daniel Bienvenu: at the beggining? only 3... later maybe 7
rich-c: there's you and james - Scott and Dale might get involved on occasion
rich-c: and that guy Eduaro who posted to teh Adam mailing list
Daniel Bienvenu: but scott had gooddealgames<
rich-c: well, that would be a competitor, I guess
Daniel Bienvenu: Eduardo may be interrested. but i think we don't have the same ehtic
rich-c: I get the feeling he might be inclined to stay independent at first
Daniel Bienvenu: AtariAge is selling Coleco games too
rich-c: OK, I am not going to pursue that too far
Daniel Bienvenu: After march, AtariAge will have a Coleco library more important than mine.
rich-c: don't know AtariAge
rich-c: of new original works or games they bought the rights to?
Daniel Bienvenu: AtariAge is the group who support Atari fans with news, forums, and selling prototypes and new Atari games (not only Atari 2600 games)
rich-c: so they are also selling new and original Colecovision games?
Daniel Bienvenu: I don't know if they always ask for the rights... that's a problem
rich-c: if they try selling yours, sue the bastards!!! ;-)
Daniel Bienvenu: AtariAge doesn't sell any Coleco prototypes but sell new games and soon conversions made by Eduardo
rich-c: any idea where they are based?
Daniel Bienvenu: i don't know where they are based
rich-c: so Eduardo is basically looking to port Coleco games to the Atari?
rich-c: doing a whois should tell you whre their website is, anyway
Daniel Bienvenu: But I talk with James sometimes and we are affraid on rights... and it's why we prepare a "LEGAL NOTICE" ... and an ethic for the new Coleco programmers who want to sell their works
rich-c: well, there should be a copyright notice built right in and displayed when a game is loaded - opening screen or splash screen
rich-c: but as long as the copyright claim and date are there, anyone plagarizes at their peril
Daniel Bienvenu: No, Eduardo said that he's converting MSX-1 games to Coleco Vision.. 5 games made by Konami. And I don't know if Eduardo ask the rights to sell all these games... it's too many, it's too big.
rich-c: it may be that Konami are simply not enforcing their rights to those games
rich-c: it then is not legal to copy or port them but there are no consequences to those who do
rich-c: not all pirates get caught and hanged - some are too small to even chase
Daniel Bienvenu: Eduardo wanted to sell his Space Invaders Collection last year... and the company say "NO". DigitalPress wanted to help Eduardo to sell the game but they abandoned after this answer from the company.
Daniel Bienvenu: It's this kind of situation James and I don't want for the new coleco web site.
Daniel Bienvenu: It's why we need legal notice, texts, faq, and many things to support programmers
rich-c: you mean Eduardo asked teh copyright holder for permkssion and was trold no?
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to Guy B.
Guy B.: Hi All!
Daniel Bienvenu: I don't think Eduardo asked for the rights the first time. I think it's a guy from DigitalPress who asked for the rights
rich-c: if so, wonder if they were just bloody-minded, or simply couldn't agree on a suitable royalty?
rich-c: hello Guy!
Guy B.: Just got home from work over an hour ago.
rich-c: good for you - we wre on then but took a half-hour break while Daniel went from his home to the university
Guy B.: I just got through reading that list that Dr D put up from Adamcon 6.
rich-c: what sort of weather are you adjusting over there for us, Guy?
rich-c: which list ws that, Guy? I don't remember
Guy B.: We had a little snow overnight. It's above freezing, but it's windy. Partly sunny too.
rich-c: we started off cloudy and above freezing, now have flurries and temp dropping
Guy B.: The one with the Adam hardware like the AIM board and Dr. D's Adamserve was mentioned.
rich-c: OK, a little too long ago for me to recall off the top of my head
Daniel Bienvenu: I don't know what is the laws in Japan about selling games... but I'm not sure it's a good idea to have a server in Japan to sell converted games without permission.
rich-c: by the way, for the information of you two, but don't spread it further...
rich-c: when Dr, D, was here I gave him my entire archive of Adam newsletters
Guy B.: Is he planning to scan and upload these to his server?
rich-c: I feel that is teh best way to guarantee their preservation and perhaps even circulation
rich-c: if he is he's found a new life work - you would not believe the volume there is
Guy B.: Must be huge?
Daniel Bienvenu: I hope James will never have problems because of a legal term.
rich-c: filled about three of those boxes that hold 5000 sheets of stationery normally
rich-c: Daniel, a game belongs to the copyright holder. If you port and sell it without permission, you can be sued
rich-c: I believe Japan is a member of the Universal Copyright Convention
rich-c: maybe he should consider relocating to a server in China ;-)
Daniel Bienvenu: But because we may have no control on that in the "virtual store"... we have to think about everything to inform the programmers.
rich-c: though I gather even the Chinese are cracking down on piracy now
Daniel Bienvenu: yes, china had a reputation of "no limit" hackers
Guy B.: Wow, that ought to take Dr. D awhile to go through.
rich-c: but the U.S. especially has been leaning on them so they are at leasst pretending to be getting tough
rich-c: yes, well I have to accept that the average age of people in my birth cohort is dead
Guy B.: China has always been a problem with pirated software.
rich-c: while I feel fine I won't last forever and Frances and Pamela would not preserve the collection
Daniel Bienvenu: do you know someone who can do a legal notice about rights, etc...?
rich-c: frankly, Daniel, I don't think there is any particular problem
Daniel Bienvenu: the only thing i can do is to think about a text... an ethic for programmers like me.
Daniel Bienvenu: it's too avoid problem I'm thinking to that
rich-c: I believe that in teh U.S. at least there is case law saying that as long as "copyright (date)" appears prominently, you're covered
rich-c: but look in a book on the back of the title page and you will find legalese that you can modify appropriately
Daniel Bienvenu: I don't want to see James having a bad experience because some games are not "legal".
rich-c: well he would have to make it a condition of posting a game that the poster declare it is all his own original work
Guy B.: I'll see you all later.
Guy B. left chat session
rich-c: OK Guy, thanks for dropping by
Daniel Bienvenu: and Guy is gone
rich-c: yes, he really pulled out quickly
rich-c: there are a lot of legal questions hanging about the internet anyway
Daniel Bienvenu: you have a good idea... a short but clear message to ask if what he's selling his an original work... i like that. but the programmers may not read and click on "YES" like a reflex.
rich-c: for instance, who's responsible for the content of a server?
Daniel Bienvenu: I saw sometimes a server who files disappear because of legal problems
rich-c: well, before anything can be uploaded, have a statement box
rich-c: let it reaed something like
rich-c: 'I declare that this item is my own original work" with "signature" (full name and address) and date required
Daniel Bienvenu: short and sweet
rich-c: if necessary, add something along teh lines of its not being derivative of any other work
rich-c: yes, if the person lies, then james can plead innocent pretty convincingly
rich-c: though he might have trouble if he posted say "Dankey Kang" and it looked and worked too much like a certain other game
rich-c: but as long as he convincingly exercised his "duty of care" he should be OK
Daniel Bienvenu: yeah, I saw many times this kind of @no name@ games who really looks like some commercials games.
Daniel Bienvenu: like my dacman project :)
Daniel Bienvenu: like kevtris by kevin horton
Daniel Bienvenu: like space invasion by John Dondzila
rich-c: yes, there are definite limits to just how close you can come to the original "inspiration"
rich-c: still, even in teh DOS world whre there's enough money in games to fight about, look how many takeoffs of Tetris exist
rich-c: and in the 8-bitters there have been a lot of - parallels? - when the owner wouldn't sell porting rights
Daniel Bienvenu: so, you say that i'm worrying too much?
Daniel Bienvenu: it's not my fault, I hope this coleco web page will be a "HIT", great success
Daniel Bienvenu: not a web site with a bad reputation
rich-c: well, it's small enough that suing you is unlikely to be a profitable activity
Daniel Bienvenu: Well, Microsoft did something like that to one person: Mike Rowe.
rich-c: remember that it costs money to hire a lawyer and pay him to write a letter
rich-c: oh yes, and they are having a big battle with Lindows now over the name
rich-c: anyway, MS have the too big sense of their own importance that comes from too much money
rich-c: it will depend on whether folks like Nintendo or Sega or such think tyou're devaluaing their rights
rich-c: but if james is not too brazen or blatant I think they'll ignore him
Daniel Bienvenu: I know that Nintendo accept nothing. Sega is more permissive
rich-c: then don't port Nintendo games ;-)
Daniel Bienvenu: but, I don't know about Konami, namco and all the oters companies.
rich-c: for that matter, some of the companies no longer exist anyway
Daniel Bienvenu: Like Exidy... still alive?
rich-c: I haven't the slightest idea - I have never had any interest in the game scene
Daniel Bienvenu: the problem is my main interrest IS in the game scene. :)
rich-c: not a problem - some are BASIC people, some CP/M, some hardware, some games - lots of room for everyone
Daniel Bienvenu: some peoples have common passion, onstalgia
rich-c: well in our community that Adam is the integrating factor
rich-c: beyond the fact, of course, that there aer all those neat people involved
rich-c: anyway, it is getting near your dinner time, isn't it?
Daniel Bienvenu: well, i will stay at the university for lunch
Daniel Bienvenu: i will be back at home tonight
rich-c: lunch? at this hour? we're thinking dinner!
rich-c: reckon you will be eating pretty late, then
Daniel Bienvenu: well, i said lunch because i have a "lunch" with sandwich, juice and many other things to eat. :)
rich-c: right, keep you going till you get home - gather you did not get up too early
Daniel Bienvenu: I'm here to use the fast internet connection
rich-c: actually, on chat it doesn't matter much - it's the speed of your typing limits things
rich-c: and of course occasionally the speed of Dale's server
rich-c: I had sort of guessed as much
Daniel Bienvenu: oops' my capslock
rich-c: I know, it catches all of us every once in a while ;-)
Daniel Bienvenu: hehe
rich-c: anyway, about time I signed off now
Daniel Bienvenu: yeah!
Daniel Bienvenu: talk to you wednesday
rich-c: see you Wednesday, then
Daniel Bienvenu: take care
Daniel Bienvenu: bye
rich-c: bye now
rich-c left chat session
moved to room Meeting Place
changed username to Dr.D. > chat > Sat 2004-02-21
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